This podcast episode explores the intricate world of Bitcoin lending, featuring a lively debate between Michael Saylor and Saifedean Ammous on the practicality of using Bitcoin as collateral and the misconception of "risk-free yield" in a Bitcoin-driven economy. It also examines various borrowing strategies, highlights Bitcoin's potential in business and investment, critiques the role of stablecoins within the financial ecosystem, and looks at the evolving dynamics between traditional banks and cryptocurrency. Additionally, the episode discusses exciting innovations like the Nostr protocol and BNY Mellon's foray into Bitcoin custodial services, stressing the importance of caution and strategic thinking in this rapidly evolving landscape.