This Stanford Psychology Podcast episode features Dr. Julia Chatain, a computer scientist and learning scientist, discussing her research on embodied learning in mathematics. The conversation explores the misconception that math is purely abstract, highlighting how sensory-motor experiences and interactive tools (VR, AR, robots) can make mathematical concepts more concrete and accessible. Dr. Chatain discusses challenges in assessing learning beyond traditional written tests, emphasizing the importance of analyzing gestures and movements. The podcast concludes with reflections on the scalability of embodied learning interventions and the need for teacher support and policy changes to integrate these methods effectively into classrooms. A key example is a VR game where students manipulate a pipe network to understand graph theory.