Should colleges actively resist the Trump administration or find ways to engage and compromise? Vanderbilt University’s chancellor, Daniel Diermeier, has emerged as a leading example of engagement — facing a mix of cheers and jeers in the academy. Jeff and Michael talked with Diermeier about why he thinks higher education needs to change, and his ambitions to grow his institution’s prestige and research impact. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group.