What if paying players actually made games more profitable?

In this episode, we sit down with Ben Cousens (Chief Strategy Officer at ZBD) to unpack how embedded payouts, loyalty rewards, and regulated payments infrastructure can radically change retention, LTV, and monetization in mobile games.

This is payments, psychology, and monetization design.

Topics covered

• Why gaming has a payments problem

• Embedded rewards vs cash-for-tasks

• How ZBD increases retention by 180%

• Sharing ad revenue with players

• Anti-fraud & compliance realities

• UA creatives that attract better cohorts

• Bank payouts & real-world spend in 2026

More on ZBD SDK: https://zbd.gg/z/rewards-sdk

Case studies mentioned: https://zbdpay.com/en/case-studies

ZBD: https://zbdpay.com

Ben Cousens : https://www.linkedin.com/in/bencousens/

RSVP to Game of Tones II: https://luma.com/07c3ffq0?utm_source=twoandahalfgamers

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This is no BS gaming podcast 2.5 gamers session. Sharing actionable insights, dropping knowledge from our day-to-day User Acquisition, Game Design, and Ad monetization jobs. We are definitely not discussing the latest industry news, but having so much fun! Let’s not forget this is a 4 a.m. conference discussion vibe, so let's not take it too seriously.

Panelists: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Felix Braberg, Matej Lancaric⁠

Special guest: Ben Cousens

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bencousens/

Join our slack channel here: https://join.slack.com/t/two-and-half-gamers/shared_invite/zt-2um8eguhf-c~H9idcxM271mnPzdWbipg

Chapters

00:00 — Why 180% retention sounds like BS?

01:35 — Ben’s background: games, banking, VC, ZBD

04:25 — What ZBD actually is (and isn’t)

06:20 — The real payments problem in gaming

09:10 — Money lifecycle in games: pay-in, move, pay-out

11:15 — Why pay-outs are allowed when pay-ins aren’t

13:00 — Embedded rewards vs “cash for tasks”

14:30 — Bitcoin Miner & easter-egg rewards explained

17:20 — Why sharing ad revenue increases LTV

19:40 — From Bitcoin wallets to direct bank payouts

22:00 — How rewards change player behavior long-term

24:00 — Fraud, bots & anti-abuse systems

26:50 — Why this works better than classic rewards apps

29:35 — Tech integration & SDK reality

31:40 — UA creatives and signaling “this game pays you”

33:45 — Regulation costs & why others can’t copy this

35:10 — What’s coming in 2026 (bank, real-world spend)

37:10 — Blurring virtual and real economies

39:20 — Who should actually use ZBD

41:10 — Final take: owning the player relationship

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Matej Lancaric

User Acquisition & Creatives Consultant

⁠https://lancaric.me

Felix Braberg

Ad monetization consultant

⁠https://www.felixbraberg.com

Jakub Remiar

Game design consultant

⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/jakubremiar

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Please share feedback and comments - matej@lancaric.me

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🤔​ What if games paid players back?

two &amp; a half gamers

🤔 What if games paid players back?

two & a half gamers